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Author Topic: Rename override VERP to Track replies  (Read 2433 times)

Michael McAndrew

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Rename override VERP to Track replies
November 23, 2010, 07:58:57 am
Word up, Word up - people, people, hear me now!!

I have a hard time explaining to people what override VERP means.  And that's even since I worked out what it meant myself.  As far as I can tell the only difference this makes to CiviMail is that it allows you to track replies and makes the email that it appears to come from civimail_email+r.50m3.num63r5@yourdomain.org.

Wouldn't it be nice if we changed the label on this to "[] track replies".

We could then explain the consequences advantages / disadvantages, etc., and all the technical stuff about VERP in a help box hidden away from the average user.

Let me know what you think and I'll submit and issue and patch.

Michael
« Last Edit: January 05, 2011, 07:33:18 am by michaelmcandrew »
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Michael McAndrew

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Re: Rename override VERP to Track replies
November 23, 2010, 08:06:15 am
ok, i see that this has been implemented already!   ::)
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lcdweb

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Re: Rename override VERP to Track replies
November 23, 2010, 08:06:35 am
3.3 (and i think 3.2) removes the option altogether (which i'm not sure i agree with)
but it at least solves the problem of confusion.

personally i think verp-constructed replies/etc. are generally a global setting, and shouldn't be set on a per-mailing basis. in my case, i have a few clients not using bounce processing, so verp is not needed (and can create problems). i would prefer disabling it globally. likewise, if bounce processing is being used, i would prefer it be set administratively and the mail sender not be given the option of disabling it.
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Piotr Szotkowski

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Re: Rename override VERP to Track replies
November 24, 2010, 08:19:48 am
Quote from: lcdweb on November 23, 2010, 08:06:35 am
verp-constructed replies/etc. are generally a global setting, and shouldn't be set on a per-mailing basis.

Note that the default is configurable already (currently via CIVICRM_TRACK_CIVIMAIL_REPLIES in civicrm.settings.php), so what you’re saying is that we should simply remove the ability to alter it on a per-mailing basis altogether (and maybe implement CIVICRM_TRACK_CIVIMAIL_REPLIES in the UI rather than as an obscure PHP option).

I’ll try to ping Xavier to see what he thinks about dropping this as a per-mailing option altogether (note that you can always do this via a custom template).
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lcdweb

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Re: Rename override VERP to Track replies
November 24, 2010, 08:49:45 am
VERP impacts other things besides replies (bounces).
I do think the "track replies" should be configurable on a per-mailing basis.
But I think you should be able to turn off VERP behavior globally.

It's quite possible I'm not making sense right now. Need more coffee...
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Michael McAndrew

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Re: Rename override VERP to Track replies
November 25, 2010, 04:42:13 am
Hey there,

I originally had two supplementary aspects to this task.

One was make it a globally configurable (agree to a certain extent that it doesn't need to be per mail configurable but is there any harm in leaving it there if it is there already)?

The other was to add a help text in the UI regarding the consequences of overriding VERP.  I think that this is useful to have, so people know that they are going to be sending out a weird reply to address if they do choose to track replies.

Quote
VERP impacts other things besides replies (bounces)

In my experience this setting doesn't affect bounce processing, but please correct me if I am wrong.  Is there anything else that it effects?

Quote
3.3 (and i think 3.2) removes the option altogether (which i'm not sure i agree with)

I thought that it just renamed it Track replies?

I can definitely see the case for a global admin setting, and would be up for writing some help text once we have confirmed if Track replies is in fact a replacement (and reversal) of override verp, and if there any any other consequences, things to consider adding to the help text.
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xavier

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Re: Rename override VERP to Track replies
November 25, 2010, 07:33:58 am
as for the UI  can you check on sandbox ? pretty sure we covered them already.

we didn't change features simply renamed an clarified what was before confusingly named VERP. And put the tracke replies off by default.
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Michael McAndrew

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Re: Rename override VERP to Track replies
November 26, 2010, 02:01:11 am
http://sandbox.civicrm.org/civicrm/admin/mail?reset=1

There is no option to globally set track replies / override verp here, which would be nice

Track replies has been changed, but it would be nice to have some extended help that addresses what happens when you turn on tracking replies.

1) you get a 'funny' reply address
2) anything else???

I don't think that bounce processing is affected - just tested on a 3.1.5 site and here are some headers:
Quote
Return-Path: <vaw+b.181.9070.803a9924e86cbfce@thirdsectordesign.org>
Reply-To: "general@vawcvs.org" <general@vawcvs.org>
From: "general@vawcvs.org" <general@vawcvs.org>
List-Unsubscribe: mailto:vaw+u.181.9070.803a9924e86cbfce@thirdsectordesign.org
To: "Michael McAndrew" <michaelmcandrew@thirdsectordesign.org>
X-CiviMail-Bounce: vaw+b.181.9070.803a9924e86cbfce@thirdsectordesign.org
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xavier

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Re: Rename override VERP to Track replies
November 26, 2010, 02:49:54 am
Ah, got you

No, no option, if I recall, there is one you can put in civicrm.settings, but not sure anymore

As for tracking replies, beside the funny reply address: if you don't check forward, it goes into civicrm and stays there silently until someone stumble upon it.

Bounce processing isn't affected indeed (bounce processing is always on).  Been various requests to make that an option. Got to admit I and the core aren't too keen on implementing that, as if you don't want to automate bounce, may be you shouldn't send mass emails in the first place.

X+
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Michael McAndrew

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Re: Rename override VERP to Track replies
November 28, 2010, 08:45:58 am
OK - so unless there are any objections, I'll go ahead and file an issue and patch that
1) adds ability to set default reply tracking on / off
2) adds tracking help text to the UI along the lines of the discussion here
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CiviTeacher.com

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Re: Rename override VERP to Track replies
December 16, 2010, 04:12:32 pm
Nice work.  PS. I just like saying "VERP".   ;) ;) ;) ;D :P
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